....................I really hope you're not in public when the results are announced.
"LOOK AT THIS GUY!!!! HE'S SHITTING AND PEEING IN PANTS RIGHT NOW!!!!"
Maybe you should just stay home. Spend the night on the toilet, ya know? Of coarse, you'll have to shut off the water first, and then flush away the remaining water first.
I mean how ELSE are you going to shit and pee your pants, without making a big mess!!! If you don't shut off the water first, it's just going to clog the toilet and make it overflow.
If anyone needs help moving to the EU (and in particular Finland) let me know. I moved to Finland after 2016 (I saw the writing on the wall for awhile, before Trump - it's just that's when I finally had the best opportunity and Trump accelerated the need to move).
It takes less money to move than you might think to move. If you have a specialty (especially in STEM) it's really easy, and most jobs will even provide language classes for free.
If you don't, it's still possible, but it'll be much harder work I'll admit. You may end up as a janitor or laborer, but know this - you'll still be able to live comfortably. Wages can be much fairer here, public transportation is excellent to the point where you don't need a car at all, and you won't be bankrupted by healthcare. Even a low skilled SINGLE job will afford you financial security - something I remember was not the case in the USA.
And on the bright side, if you want to go to higher education here, university is a lot cheaper or, if you live long enough in a place to become a permanent resident or citizen, free.
If you get yourself at least 8k and 3 months of intensive Duolingo and maybe Mondly, you have a chance to move.
It takes less money to move than you might think to move. If you have a specialty (especially in STEM) it’s really easy, and most jobs will even provide language classes for free.
Unfortunately I picked the wrong specialty (architecture). Still trying to get licensed by the end of the year, that's the only chance I have at another country maybe recognizing my degree. Regardless, it's not very in-demand.
It is in the Nordics and some western Europe countries if you get some kind of green certification, as eco friendly and energy efficient architecture is in high demand to meet climate goals but there's a lack of architects specializing in that. Though from the news here it seems there's a lack of architects in general as it was seen by many as not the most profitable field for so many years, so ironically you kinda lucked out lol
Finland is one of three countries that banned my wife and stepdaughter's race by using a procedural "gotcha." Despite being a part of the Apostille convention in Geneva, Finland, Germany and Greece refuse to accept any documentation from Philippines. Therefore, they are banned from your country entirely.
Thanks for the offer though.
Reminder to all here: USA is not the only country on the planet with racism.
Could you go into more details? I have friends from the Philippines (like, directly from there, never were US citizens) and they still even visit family every year.
I'm not denying there's racism here - there is, especially against Muslims (possibly more their religion and culture than the race itself, since it's viewed very misogynistic and against Finnish values) and Somalians (this one is just racism based off ignorance). Recently against Russians too for, well, obvious reasons.
But none of my Philippine friends have experienced racism, especially the ones with Hispanic names (there's Hispanic favoritism here).
Of course, racism isn't why I recommend moving out of the USA to anywhere in the EU - it's the civil unrest, unjust work practices, broken healthcare, rolling back of women's and LGBTQ rights, corruption in government, etc.
Are you sure it wasn't missing paperwork or errors? I'm assuming your wife doesn't have a US passport for example since you said all paperwork was from the Philippines, and my high school friend's grandmother mentioned Philippine record keeping, much like Salvadorian one, leaves much to be desired. Especially after Duterte's reign making things worse and not complying with other global governments, if this was 2016-2022.
I don’t have direct knowledge on whether or not Duterte made all of this worse, but I suspect you’re correct. Philippines is worlds behind on records, which is why I understand the purpose of the Apostille certification agreement.
According to USA friends he fucked with records of ex-pats and it was a nightmare for a bit when their family members were getting citizenship. That's why I also brought him up.
It didn’t seem that way, but the behavior of the Grecian consulate officer said otherwise.
We had been planning a trip to Italy and Greece for two years. We’ve been paying on the trip monthly. My wife and stepdaughter are Filipino citizens, here in the USA as permanent residents. They have applied for citizenship. Since they still have Filipino passports, they must apply for Schengen visas.
We we through the process of applying. We live in north Alabama. We were initially told we would have to fly to Tampa, FL to apply in person for the visa. I contacted the consulate and asked if we could instead apply in Atlanta since it was closer and I was having to check our daughter out of school to attend the visa appointment. They said that was fine.
We made plans and checked out of work and school to drive to Atlanta. We arrived on time and had most (if not all) of the paperwork that we were aware that needed to be completed. I could tell right away from the sneer of the attendant that there was going to be a problem. When she saw my wife and stepdaughter her attitude changed almost immediately. She took our paperwork, then made us sit in the waiting room about 45 minutes. Finally, she came back out with a guy dressed in suit. He asked me to come back to speak with him. I’m not the one applying for the visa.
I came back to the office and he explained that in 2019 there was a convention in Geneva that most countries signed onto - it was called the Apostille convention. It was intended to resolve the issue of countries certifying documents like birth and marriage certificates for use abroad. I understood the issue, since other countries do not really know who the certifying authorities are. I told him I would gather the information. They also wanted a certified letter stating that I would sponsor and support my wife and stepdaughter abroad during the trip. I’m like… uhh, ok dude, this is my wife and yes we share finances but ok.
So he asked me to return to the waiting area while they looked into other things and I gathered the income information they wanted (this information was above and beyond what was stated on the website, so I had to pull my W-2 records to satisfy their requirements).
After some time, the suit came back out and asked me to come back to the office again. This time, my wife and daughter also got up. He let me into the office, then put his hand up in my wife’s face and said, “Not you” and shut the door in her face.
Now I know something’s really wrong.
The man holds up my marriage certificate (we got married in Philippines) and my stepdaughter’s birth certificate and said, “These are garbage. They shouldn’t have even let them in the USA.”
I asked him very calmly to explain and he again brought up the Apostille convention. He said that we must supply the required Apostille certification for the documents and “they shouldn’t have let them in the country without it.” I said ok, well, while I was waiting I researched this and found that I can get an electronic Apostille certification from Philippines and get this resolved.
The man rolled his eyes and gathered the paperwork up and slammed the folder shut. The lady said, “we’ll take your money and keep their passports and run the application after you get the required information emailed back to us. Have a nice day.” They took our $180 and kept the passports and ushered us out.
I got home that night and then went to the Philippines website to process the Apostille certification for our documents and started the process. That’s where I noticed on the Philippines website that despite all of these countries being privy to the Apostille convention, Finland, Germany and Greece have “elected” to not accept any documentation from Philippines even if it’s certified electronically. The only way to have them certify an Apostille document is to fly all the way to Manila, have an appointment with their consulates in Manila, and ask them nicely to certify the documents and Apostille seal.
Since that wasn’t happening, we had to cancel our trip.
Instead, I’m writing this comment from a first class seat to Hawaii. Our flight credits were enough to pay for a first class round trip to Honolulu for our family of 5.
Normally I would say it was just a paperwork snafu, but the treatment of my wife and daughter at the Greek consulate suggests otherwise.
Fuck Greece (and Finland and Germany too). Respectfully.
Wait, I'm confused. You went to a Greek consulate that wasn't assigned to your location, and never interacted with Finnish or German ones but lumped them in? And why didn't you apply for the Schengen visa using your wife's US paperwork? She's a permanent resident of the USA after all, and should have a social security number no?
But also, none of that has to do with the approval process of moving to a EU country
You cannot apply based on US permanent residence. You must use the process based on citizenship at the time of desired entry.
Finland and Germany are lumped into this because they also refuse to accept Filipino paperwork, according to the Apostille site. This is despite their agreement to the convention, of which Philippines is a part.
Schengen visa rules dictate that you must apply at either the country you enter first or the country you are planning to spend the most time in. In our case, Greece was the answer to both of those questions. Had we applied to Italy, they would have refused to process the Schengen visa and told us to apply at Greece, who refuses to accept the papers.
We asked the Tampa consulate if it was possible to apply in Atlanta instead, and they agreed to this request. We did not show up to the Atlanta consulate blind or without their permission.
The reason I brought this into the discussion is because an EU country is very difficult for us to move into until my wife and daughter become US citizens. I expounded on the experience because I was asked.
From my understanding what you said and texting my friends, sounds like a paperwork issue. They never had trouble, but yeah, they lived in the Philippines. The issue in your case is that she doesn't live in the Philippines, so yes, she has to go there for the process because that's the only country she's a citizen of currently, although it would probably be possible to also do through a Phillipine embassy.
So they do accept Phillipine paperwork, but only official documents from the country itself.
Did you not have any official paperwork from there first notorized by the US? That's what's usually done in cases like yours, like my Highschool's friend's grandmother had to do when she got her US citizenship as well (so it's something you might want to look into anyway just in case).
That's probably your confusion on them "refusing" to accept the paperwork (although of course it also sounds like you had to deal with a racist cunt).
That said, it's weird for you to judge entire countries as super racist when you live in Alabama based off a few racists. I mean, even my black friends from when I lived in Texas didn't like stopping in Alabama. Just, something to consider for the future. I know racism can be extremely infuriating having experienced it both myself and seeing it done to my family, but you always have to remember that the asshole doesn't make the nation. Otherwise you end up also becoming what you hate.
We had original marriage certificates from Philippines with the PSA seal. We also had original birth certificates from PSA for my daughter. The USA accepted them without question for our visa and green card processing.
These are the documents that the consular officer held up to my face and said “these are garbage.”
We were not aware of the Apostille certification process and the USA, despite being a member of the convention, did not require this extra certification for our documents.
Greece would only accept them after they have been presented in person at their Manila consulate with the Apostille certification.
I did not feel it was a racism issue until the consular officers’ behavior made it feel evident there was more to it than a paperwork snafu.
I agree that I portrayed Finland and Germany as racist in an unfair fashion, that was unintended. The racism was evident only at this Greek consulate.
Yeah, I'm pretty certain that racist asshole used bureaucracy to be an asshole.
But you should get them notarized in the USA when you can in the future just in case. Harder for smaller countries to not accept diverging when a country line the USA already legally okays it.
Hawaii is nicer than Greece. My brother lives in Waikiki. If they exterminate the mosquitoes then it truly would be pretty close to a mythical tropical paradise.
Lol. Opportunity to be on the other side of the brain drain effect but refuse it. Fine, some other continent will reap the benefits of a bunch of smart expats.
Well, as an Australian I'd hope they'd not come here either, happy to have refugees and help then out as much as possible but not Americans.
As to brain drain, you come from a country that's destroying the planet, acts like a spoiled child when it doesn't get it's way, (look at the reaction to the ICC arrest warrants for Israel) you've created a monster that has little to admire, the "brains" that created all that will hopefully stay there.
This is a country that has threatened to invade the Hague if any US person or allly is indicted by the ICC for example. Churlish doesn't even begin to describe it, stay there.
If we had had that attitude when fascism was on the rise in Europe we would never have gotten Einstein or Tesla or half of our best and brightest.
We became so much better by taking in anti-facist refugees in the past, it's funny and sad to see these edgy comments when the situation is reversed. I'm proud we weren't so stupid in our history, we benefited greatly from taking them.
Einstein or…Tesla(!) yeah that’s exactly the brain farts we’d get from you clowns. You’re all scam artists one way or another. No Einsteins in sight,
We don’t have vacancies anyway,
I guess "get fucked", realistically speaking. I can't afford to leave on my own, my social life is empty of anyone else I can depend on, and I will almost certainly have a target on my back as a gay guy -- after they're done with trans people, we'll probably be next.
The only family I have supporting me right now doesn't want to leave the country and can't provide meaningful support from afar, meaning I have to stay here. And staying during a second Trump term could be dangerous very quickly indeed if I'm to believe even half of the insane shit coming out of Project 2025.
other than my family, I just don't have much luck making connections with other people, I get along better with dogs. Unfortunately, dogs don't help pay rent. worse, if Trump wins another term, I would actually consider it dangerous to be openly gay. Not that I was getting dates anyways, but it means I probably won't try anymore if it's going to put me or my family at risk of harassment.
I'm just trying to enjoy every day I have with my family and try not to panic too hard, now, mostly through distracting myself with weed and videogames. I don't know how soon things will get bad, but I don't think we have the resources necessary to protect us from what's coming if he wins again. We're struggling as is -- I've lost my job recently, I had to go through cancer this past year, I'm depressed -- I don't also need to be shit-scared of how the election plays out. Even if he loses, so much is still so fucked with our country right now.
Also, just to toot my own horn, I felt pretty proud of that last one. I initially was like "how the heck do you casually drop Fenrir or David in a sentence" but... It's not nearly as elegant as Chance.
Yeah, I mean it's easier to do online since generally I move in fairly sex-positive circles. With my in-person friend it was because I misheard what she said. I thought she mentioned that she'd ordered dildos and whatnot from a particular book store and I was like "wait, they have dildos??" We'd only met like a couple hours earlier, but we've been good friends ever since. 😅
Hope it's not as bad as I think ("as bad as I think" means "mass killings;") What else can I do? Everyone else here seems to be privileged enough to have the skills or plain cash to say "I'll go somewhere else," isn't as worried as they should be, or think they're Apocalypse Badass Man (see: accelerationists.) That's not me. I'm unskilled, poor, I have the self-introspection to know I don't have what it takes to be a revolutionary.
I'd still prefer to not get set back another decade by having him in office, and the danger of him never leaving office by way of dismantling all of the safeguards that prevented his coup in 2021 can't be ignored.
If there are ways I can resist, I will. If there are people I can help just by reaching out, I will extend my hand to them. I won't let Trump's hateful rhetoric poison my humanity or turn me against my fellow man.
If things get bad enough, my girlfriend and I have a "bug-out" plan that we discussed and agreed upon that basically amounts to - withdraw everything from our financial accounts, sell everything that isn't nailed down if we can or abandon everything in place, round up the family and buy plane/boat tickets to head somewhere that has low requirements for citizenship or will accept American petitions for political asylum if things get desperate enough. This is in the worst-case scenario where the U.S. descends into a full fascist/totalitarian state and there is a clear and present danger of us getting killed just for being political dissidents.
Ideally, we'd like to stay here and hope that things get better, but every year things seem to get worse and worse. The American Dream is dead and rotting, and we can just barely see a pinhole of light at the end of the tunnel for us to be able to achieve a life, but we're both left wondering if we're even going to be able to hold on to that if we do manage to seize it given how much the economy is backsliding each year.
tl;dr: the plan is to keep our heads down, but our spirits as high as possible, and always know where the closest exit is in case of an emergency.
I was going to say something along similar lines, once the borders are ordered shut, you'll have a much harder time getting out of dodge, not impossible, but much, much harder.
No, but the power to make laws lies in the senate / congress. If they are also in republican hands then together they could possibly change the laws to enact a dictatorship.
Pretty much, the Republican party all the way up to Trump doesn't even hide that they're anti-Democracy, and attempts to break democratic systems that underpin our entire government nay our way of life are basically out in the open.
This is for everyone that is taking the "oh well" stance... or the I'm going to wait it out stance... If you are unfamiliar with what the Republicans plan to do, I encourage you to look at the Project 2025 plan.
Some highlights
slash funding for the DOJ
dismantle the FBI
decimate environmental and climate change regulations in favor of fossil fuels
eliminate the department of commerce
ending the independence of multiple federal agencies
abolish the department of education
scientific funding would be limited to pro-conservative principles
end abortion nationwide
infuse government with Christianity
criminalize pornography
removing protections against discrimination for sexual or gender identity
terminating diversity, equity and inclusion programs and affirmative action
the military would be used for domestic law enforcement
the arrest and detention of undocumented immigrants
speedy capital punishment
Project director Paul Dans, a former Trump administration official, explained that Project 2025 is "systematically preparing to march into office and bring a new army, aligned, trained, and essentially weaponized conservatives ready to do battle against the deep state."
So, for fucks sake, can we stop saying that we can wait out Trump for another term. There won't be an America left if there is another term.
the problem is, when it's illegal, and you get caught, you'll face the consequences.
Or if you did something else wrong. VPN installed to look at porn? Well, now you did two things wrong, you must be a super special bad person. More prison time for you.
The people behind it don't care in the slightest that you watch porn. They care to have something in hand against you in case you're falling out of line
This sounds like a perfectly reasonable plan from the perspective of a conservative. Criminalize porn so people have to take the urges out elsewhere, criminalize abortions so rape victims have to give birth, and slash social services and education funding to create the next generation of uninformed, emotionally-driven voters.
The non-voters don’t care. The ones that actually subscribe to the ignorant narrative of single issue protesting are too stubborn to admit they’re wrong. And the rest of them are right-wing/Russian propagandists.
Basically, what you shared is what either of the aforementioned will use as a platform to bolster their effort to sell everyone on their bullshit ideology.
I think they do care, they've just been taught that their vote doesn't matter. This seems to be especially true of non-white people i talk to. How can we encourage people to engage? A meme or a list of concerns is not going to change their mindset when they've been manipulated into generations of apathetic resistance.
No, they’re upset over a single issue every election year. They’re easily manipulated. That’s it.
This happens every four years. Like clock work. They find some hot button social issue and use it to hold our election ransom.
And also, If they thought their votes don’t matter, they wouldn’t threaten to not vote at all or vote third party if they don’t get their way. Because if their votes didn’t matter- it would be empty threats.
The people I've spoken with who don't vote are mostly black or brown and aren't withholding votes because of some issue. They've never voted. I invited a friend to go primary vote with me and she said, "no thanks, but you have fun with that."
The degree to which one person’s vote matters is a simple matter that is easily seen. There’s no room for “believing” anything.
In the USA for instance, a Presidential vote is extremely unlikely to change the election outcome. Therefore, that vote doesn’t matter very much.
The idea that voting makes a difference, for the individual, is an illusion we use to get people to vote. In the most basic, real, concrete way, which way I vote in an election does not make a difference.
What am I supposed to do then. I tried voting progressive and Democrat, I tried organizing, I tried donating and fund raising, I tried at the local level.
And every step of the way the Democrats have gone out of their way to help move the goal posts to the point that my choices for a school board member we're someone openly racist or someone who is openly sexist.
For president I get genocide or fascism... Gee really motivating me there folks.
you get one choice that has shown he can be pressured with reason and public opinion
and one that wants to commit domestic crimes with impunity, that openly wants to have his political enemies killed, and that has shown he can be pressured by Russia. You know, the country that swore to defeat the US from within.
I will never suggest any form of equivalency because there simply is not one. The republican party is clearly a bad actor and comparing the democrats and suggesting they are in some way an equal evil is a ludicrous fallacy.
But that does not mean that voting democrat is an imperative, nor that they become a valid choice because the "others" are invalid.
The bulk of my voting power comes from republican primaries where I can have an outsized impact on which evil will get the chance to run, but beyond that my votes count for nothing.
My point is simply that if the democrats actually cared about making a difference, they would not prop up dead candidates, they would not bend over backwards to help move the goal posts for the republicans. What they could really do is change the laws around how we vote, create automatic registration, make election days mandatory holidays with mandatory time off to vote, pass laws around campaign fiance and transparency. But they wont, because the same tools help them "win" and have power.
Just look at Trudeau, who ran on a platform of voting reform in Canada, the second he had control he dropped that promise like it was radioactive. Why voluntarily break the system that put him and his party into power.... It clearly worked for them before. Same logic applies to the dem's in the US. They wont change the system, even while its being broken, because they still think it gives them a shot at power. We dont need power, we need actual population based representation and robust protection from corporate ownership of our government.
Swede here, we just joined NATO and this shit terrifies me, and what is worse is that this is what people are saying publicly, how far will they go in practice?
Nah, I doubt they'll manage what they say. Some maybe, and shit'll suck no doubt, but there's a lot of inertia in the bureaucracy. My real worry is what the CCP & Russia will do once they have a green light that the US won't intervene in their expansionist ideals.
I mean do you like being woken up at 5 am every day? Because we had chickens growing up and it sucked. But with the price of eggs these days, maybe it's a good tradeoff.
There's not much to do except try to stay in my house and not engage with the outside world any more than I have to for four years.
It's also not like the Democrats are going to reign Trump in in any significant way. (Don't get me wrong. I'm voting for Biden, I just don't expect much.)
You are making a lot of assumptions. If everything goes absolutely perfectly we might have an end in four years. I doubt it though. This man has already started dismantling our government with his federalist society stooges on the court. He plans to gut the executive branch so there is no Opposition within government. He has shown he will use violence to keep power.
You don’t oppose fascism by being quiet. You oppose it by being loud and making it impossible for them to do their evil shit.
Yeah, on the podcast “Cool People Who Did Cool Stuff” by Margaret Killjoy she talked about a group of art students who slipped piece of paper with fake spy shit on them in Nazis coats and car and what not to frame them as part of a conspiracy. It ended up sparking a rebellion in the army and helped destroy its cohesiveness.
Trump will eventually do something that gets between rich people and their money while also being an impeachable offense. The "sane" bussiness republican VP will pardon Trump after his impeachment and have him live out the rest of his life as a fox news call in guest until he died of "old age".
If we're lucky he'll piss off his Russian contacts and end up falling out a window by accident.
More likely is that this puppet will be used by bad actors to advance their agendas and as usual he'll distract everybody from the actual bad shit happening.
It was shocking to see how much better of a society Japan was when I visited. Really the one thing they don’t do as well as us is create shareholder value. To which I say, who gives a fuck?
I hope you’re Japanese or can pass for it. As beautiful as the country is (I loved it there) they are highly xenophobic and racist. There are literally restaurants where foreigners aren’t allowed in (even if you’ve lived there decades), getting housing in most places requires you to be “sponsored” by someone with a very high upfront fee, etc.