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CynAq , 1 month ago to ActuallyAutistic group

@actuallyautistic
#ActuallyAutistic

I have issues with the "top-down ( purported to be most NTs)" and "bottom-up (purported to be most autistics)" thinking binary.

I don't think these labels identify the differences as I believe this is an issue of motivation and value judgement.

Let's take the common example of essay writing for school. The story goes "when they asked us to write an outline, the NT students got right on it while the ND kids were bewildered because how could they write a bullet point version of an essay that didn't exist yet."

This makes intuitive sense to everyone who experienced the frustration of being asked to write that outline so we connect over this and give this as an example of our "thinking style" difference from the NT population.

If we actually think about this a little, though, the example, while a common experience, doesn't actually demonstrate how our thinking differs.

First, NTs and NDs both need to acknowledge the concept of an essay. If we then say "the NTs get right on writing the outline when asked to do so, which means their brain started from the concept of an essay, then automagically filled it out with a list of section titles, then guided their person through the acts necessary to fill out those sections," does this sufficiently explain what is happening? After all, the ND people can write research essays, and without coming up with an outline first too!

I think there's something deeper going on here. I think, the main difference is priorities, not the method of thinking.

In my opinion, when asked to write an essay, most NT people respond by asking "why" or even "what's in it for me" first, and since the school structure pre-answers that question for them, move onto "how," which is also formalized for their convenience: "start by thinking of possible questions and reword them as titles, put them in a list. This way, you won't have to experience the inconvenience of being curious for once." The entire process is optimized for form over substance.

In the same situation, putting the curiosity first, most ND people respond by "<insert every question possible>", and concluding "I'm going to start looking into it." No instruction necessary because the ND brain here optimized the question asking part of the endeavor. The information will be gathered and new questions will form and then more information will be gathered until there's too much of it and..." Yeah... "why are we doing this again?" Notice the "how" isn't very important here, even though it's included in the "every question possible" because after all, what can be more natural than making observations and learning other people's observations and then putting them into a report of facts? Substance rules, and form will emerge as a necessity.

So, I like thinking about "substantial (substance first)" and "formal (form first)" modes of thinking rather than "bottom-up" vs "top-down".

If you're still reading, thanks!

I'm curious as to what everyone else thinks about this issue :)

pathfinder , 1 month ago to ActuallyAutistic group

@actuallyautistic

Much to my shock I realised that I could be autistic when I was 53, roughly 7 years ago. And it was a shock, even though I suspect a very small, well hidden and very much ignored part of me, might have suspected. No one told me about it, or suggested that it might be the case. I did not see myself in relatives, the way so many of us do. I just happened to come across an autism test online and for no particular reason, took it.

It was that, that started me on my path to realising and finally accepting the truth that I was autistic. But, looking back, I sometimes find it hard to understand how I didn't know earlier. So much of my life now, just screams autism at me. But even ignoring the horribly ableist and medieval view I had of what autism was, the main reason why I didn't was probably because I could mask, both from myself and others, so well.

It was, I realise now, a life lived in denial. A denial of how much things bothered me, how much effort I had to put into things. Even a denial of the things I knew I couldn't do. Because this is the thing about appearing to mask so well, for so long. It is, in a sense, a lie. I couldn't mask well, if at all. Not all the time. Not in all situations or circumstances. There were things I just couldn't cope with, or even begin to deal with. But the trick was, that I either knew about them, or learnt the hard way about them and then I could manage my life to avoid them. Because they were things I could live without, without affecting how I appeared to be coping. Things that didn't affect the way I lived, even if they did affect my sense of worth. Because, how broken did you have to be, not to be able to go to crowded events, like a sports match, or a concert? Or to be able to deal with the socialising of a large gathering, or a family event, without having to hide in the kitchen, or forever outside, or break down in a toilet?

It was all part of how I masked myself from myself. The internal masking, as I like to call it. If I couldn't cope, then I was broken. If I couldn't stand something, then I was too picky, or sensitive, or I simply needed to learn to ignore it. And somehow I did learn. I learnt how to cope with noise and smell and visual overwhelm. I learnt to not let things bother me. To a point at least. There was always a step too far, when I couldn't, or didn't have the energy any more to maintain it. And this did take energy, a lot of it. Something I've only realising now that I don't have the energy to spare to even try it. Or the ability to, in many respects now that I know what I was trying so desperately to hide from.

Because when the truth is known, it's far harder to deny it. It's far harder to live the life where appearing to cope, is as good as coping. Where blaming yourself, is easier than seeing others faults. Where ignoring the pain, makes the pain go away. It's hard to see the mask as a benefit and always a good thing, rather than the shield and tool it always was.

#Autism
#ActuallyAutistic

punishmenthurts , 1 month ago to ActuallyAutistic group

#ActuallyAutistc
@actuallyautistic
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I don’t know about you, but my self diagnosis was anything but fast or easy. It was sixty year goddam treasure hunt where anyone who knew or could have known anything made a point of keeping it a secret.
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No matter the troubles I was having, the messaging from family (who absolutely all knew) and doctors and psychologists was all NT conformism:You are Normal. We are All the Same.
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Self diagnosis is about as easy as a salmon finding its breeding spot after a thousand miles of white water. It’s an against all odds kind of deal, at least for us olds.
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Neurotypes are the biggest secret in the world, because We are All the Same, they say. They don’t like self diagnosis because it’s when we win the game of Hide and Seek, we are Kicking the Can when we self discover, winning the game.
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😈❤️