Women-only social media app Giggle for Girls taken to court by transgender woman Roxanne Tickle after her account was restricted ( www.abc.net.au )

  • In short: Transgender woman Roxanne Tickle is suing social media platform Giggle for Girls after she was excluded from the women-only app.
  • She is alleging unlawful discrimination on the basis of gender identity while the app's founder has denied she is a woman.
  • What's next? The hearing is expected to run for four days.

A transgender woman who was excluded from a women-only social media app should be awarded damages because the app's founder has persistently denied she is a woman, a Sydney court has heard.

In February 2021, Roxanne Tickle downloaded the Giggle for Girls social networking app, which was marketed as a platform exclusively for women to share experiences and speak freely.

Users needed to provide a selfie, which was assessed by artificial intelligence software to determine if they were a woman or man.

Ms Tickle's photograph was determined to be a woman and she used the app's full features until September that year, when the account became restricted because the AI decision was manually overridden.

ZK686 ,

Welcome to 2024, women can't have their own things anymore... (and I'm talking about REAL women, you know, the individuals have two X chromosomes).

CosmicCleric ,
@CosmicCleric@lemmy.world avatar

Ms Tickle’s photograph was determined to be a woman and she used the app’s full features until September that year, when the account became restricted because the AI decision was manually overridden.

I'd love to know the story behind the manual overriding.

Silentiea ,
@Silentiea@lemm.ee avatar

Apparently she defended trans people in a conversation, someone complained, and moderators got involved and manually overrode the ai. Paraphrased hearsay.

SpaceCowboy ,
@SpaceCowboy@lemmy.ca avatar

If the AI is the good guy in a situation, you gotta be doing something very wrong.

RagingRobot ,

I think she will win this. They didn't require a genital photo so what's even their proof? Arbitrary requirement anyways. Rules like that only leave people out. I understand the want for a space like that though. I hope this woman finds a space where she can feel safe.

ZK686 ,

Why not create an app for trans women?

john89 ,

I don't understand.

It's okay to discriminate against men but not transgender women?

Plague_Doctor ,

Trans women are women.

EatATaco ,

I down voted, not because I disagree with the claim, but because it doesn't make any sense in the context and just reads as a knee-jerk dismissive response of a valid point.

Plague_Doctor ,

It's true though. Gender is a performance, and as a woman your womanhood is always under scrutiny from everyone else. You can get your identity as woman taken from you if you don't "look woman enough". Which if you say have more masculine features, cut your hair short as a cis woman you become less woman. For example Butch lesbians are actually the most often de-womanized. Same goes for less masculine men. It's a box no one fits into perfectly and having certain genitals doesn't include or exclude you from either.

This person wanted a safe space where they wouldn't have to deal with cis straight men. Which makes it that if men want inclusion in such spaces they need to be better.

Another question for you all, why as cis men do you want inclusion in these spaces?

ZK686 ,

So, what about those who are born with a uterus? Where can they go? What if they decide, only those who were born with a vagina at birth, are women and we want only those to be part of our organization? I mean, are they wrong?

UnderpantsWeevil ,
@UnderpantsWeevil@lemmy.world avatar

Real /r/unpopularopinion moment.

I think the thing that the TERFs ultimately miss is that this person was initially welcomed in as a woman and treated as a woman by her peers. She did not disrupt the community or harass any of the participants, until she voiced support for Trans Rights.

It was at this point that a handful of moderators decided to interrogate her on her original gender and use that as an excuse to boot an active and in-good-standing member.

So she wasn't removed for "not being a woman". She was removed for "disagreeing with the political views of the admin".

Anyone familiar with Reddit politics should be able to sympathize.

ZK686 ,

I don't understand? Reddit politics is ultra liberal, they would eat this women's app alive for discriminating against the trans.

PuddingFeeling907 ,
@PuddingFeeling907@lemmy.ca avatar

Yes you’re right the transphobes are taking over here

ZK686 ,

Lol...what? I've read like 3 comments saying that the app is in the right, the overwhelmingly majority are siding with the trans...

ZK686 ,

I define a woman as a female who has a uterus, how should I define them?

FlyingSquid Mod ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

So if a woman has a hysterectomy, she is no longer a woman? What is she?

ZK686 ,

That's silly and you know it. She still had one to begin with. That's like saying "if a dude cuts off his penis, he's no longer a dude!"

FlyingSquid Mod ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

I define a woman as a female who has a uterus

Your definition. Has a uterus. You said nothing about a female who had a uterus.

And you haven't defined female.

ZK686 ,

Oh brother...

FlyingSquid Mod ,
@FlyingSquid@lemmy.world avatar

It's not my fault that your definition excluded women who had a uterus at one time but didn't later.

How about women who have two X chromosomes but were born without a uterus? Not women?

ZK686 ,

Oh brother...let's just agree to disagree...it's obvious what side of the issue you're on...

prof ,
@prof@infosec.pub avatar

While I certainly agree with you that discrimination based on sex is unacceptable im most contexts, I believe that gender exclusive spaces, unless they hinder people directly, sometimes are a good thing.

My dad is a mental health professional and founded a weekly 'only-men' self help group. He found that some things they talked about there wouldn't have worked with women involved. That group existed for about 5 years or so and helped quite a few struggling men.

So yeah, unless there's any maliciousness involved, I'd argue that gender exclusiity is not bad in every context.

Taohumor ,

I remember back in high school I had a teacher in an all male classroom because it was a stem field but for kids like an introductory course. A girl showed up in the 2nd year and he sort of joked about how it changes the dynamic cuz now all the guys will need to flex for her so the point of the class was sort of ruined. I remember that class was actually fucking amazing because you would make friends with guys regardless of your social circle or wealth background. Like I talked to multiple demographics and we all treated each other equally and we were all there to learn the trade. It was an amazing experience that I've never found anywhere else, especially not any circle where there were women. Hell even guys who were in that class there were a few if you met them outside the class it was just different. I made some close friends there where we kept spending time together outside the class that I otherwise would not have met but others when they got back to "the rest of the world" that hierarchy set back in and they couldn't bring themselves to talk to you on that level anymore. Women invading male safe spaces under the guise of glass ceilings or whatever was extremely toxic for men, it's as if men started barging into women's bathrooms honestly saying it's a glass ceiling to their right to stare at women in their own private moments. Stupid example but it's all I could come up with.

The point is I would love to find another environment like that and even I wish I looked for more like that as a kid and to have appreciated it for what it was more at the time. Men need to learn to see each other as brothers and not as opposition, that's the only way we get out of this mess is to unionize properly. I think we had it once but we lost it because of this fucking propaganda painting men as inherently predators.

9488fcea02a9 ,

So.... Men act like dicks when there is a woman around or when they are back in "the rest of the world"? At which point their sense of brotherly love and cameraderie disappear? How is that a woman's fault?

How is that the fault of, "fucking propaganda painting men as inherently predators"?

Sounds like a problem with that group of men....

I have tons of male friends who dont "flex" or act like dicks when they are outside of an all-male setting

I'm not against men's clubs, btw.... But the idea that men cant be toxic outside of a men's club is a terrible premise for a men's club

Taohumor ,

You a guy?

CileTheSane ,
@CileTheSane@lemmy.ca avatar

Women invading male safe spaces under the guise of glass ceilings or whatever was extremely toxic for men, it's as if men started barging into women's bathrooms

So the class wasn't a "men only" class, it just was a class women generally weren't interested in. And a woman deciding she is interested was the same as men barging into women's bathrooms.

Jfc, who are the snowflakes again?

Taohumor ,

The men. I'm a woman.

CileTheSane ,
@CileTheSane@lemmy.ca avatar

Oh, so was your entire story a lie too?

endhits ,

If women have gender exclusive spaces, men also should have them. Women have invaded male spaces for decades.

iegod ,

'Invaded' lol what. Dude the boys club is a real thing. And it's everywhere.

Cethin ,

In pretty confident this person would agree with you. They'd also say women shouldn't be allowed there. They don't want the boys club to go away and think it's being threatened because women are allowed in the workplace or whatever.

PuddingFeeling907 ,
@PuddingFeeling907@lemmy.ca avatar

Your account is a day old so I’m thinking you’re arguing in bad faith and are likely transphobic.

john89 ,

🥱

ZK686 ,

Why not just create a "trans" app and make your own people happy too?

john89 ,

Sounds like a good idea to me.

BombOmOm ,

What’s the point of a woman’s only app (or any women’s only space) if they let anyone in simply based on them saying ‘I’m a woman’?

BassTurd ,

Because she is a woman. It's really that simple.

  • All
  • Subscribed
  • Moderated
  • Favorites
  • •
  • [email protected]
  • kbinchat
  • All magazines
    •