Lumisal ,

Apparently he thinks data is like the ducks you find in the park

Capitao_Duarte ,
@Capitao_Duarte@lemmy.eco.br avatar

Wait, you can steal from those ducks?

Lumisal ,

No one ever tells you this, but you can just take the ducks. Just like with the city pigeons. Just make sure you don't take a government drone by accident.

Fungah ,

They're the same thing.

irreticent ,
@irreticent@lemmy.world avatar
masterspace ,

In that I can take a picture of them and you wouldn't notice or be impacted by it?

Lumisal ,

You can take the ducks you know

afraid_of_zombies ,

Clearly ducks you find in the park is just free meat. Why else would they be there?

Lumisal ,

To ask of you have any grapes

Brickardo ,

Does Netflix count as the open web? It definitely feels like so, but I'm ready for a wealth hoarder to tell me otherwise!

dinckelman ,

Just yet another proof, that the more 0's you have in your valuation, the less the laws apply to you

Paragone ,

Is his personal-information on the dark-web?

Is he saying that if his personal-information is on the dark-web, then it's perfectly-OK for everybody & their robot to be using it??

XOR is he saying that there are 2 kinds of law:

1 for protecting his entitlement,

the other for disallowing rights from the lives he consumes, through his beloved herd/corporation/pseudo-person?

( obviously, he's already answered the latter )

bilb ,
@bilb@lem.monster avatar

I agree

nl4real ,

Oh hey, Microsoft support moving away from copyright! Trollface

interdimensionalmeme ,

Copyright infrigment is not theft, training models is not copyright infringement either. We need a law equivalent to when an artist says "he's inpired by someone else" . That it specifically is illegal to do that without permission if you use a machine.
That will force big tech to pay a pittance for it and it will instakill all the small player.

elias_griffin ,
@elias_griffin@lemmy.world avatar

Copyright Infringment strawman argument. When considering AI, we are not talking legal copyright infringement in the relationship between humans vs AI. Humans are mostly concerned with being obsoleted by Big Tech so the real issue is Intellectual Property Theft.

artificial INTELLIGENCE stole our Intellectual Property

Do you see it now?

afraid_of_zombies ,

What I see is a system of laws that came about during the Middle Ages and have been manipulated by the powers that be to kill off any good parts of them.

We all knew copyright was broken. It was broken before my grandparents were born. It didn't encourage artists or promise them proper income, it didn't allow creations to gradually move into public domain. It punished all forms of innovation from player pianos to fanfiction on Tumblr.

interdimensionalmeme ,

It's only theft as long as you cling to the failed "copyright" model.

Big tech couldn't steal anything if we don't respect their property rights in the first place.

By reifying copyright under the AI paradigm, we maintain big tech's power over us.

The truth is chatgpt belong to us. ClosedAI is just the compiler of the data.

If we finally end the failed experiment of copyright, we destroy their mote.

bitchkat ,

Creating a derivative work without a license to do so would be copyright infringement.

GBU_28 ,

Essentially the joke everyone made about nfts.

rc__buggy ,

I think that with respect to content that’s already on microsoft.com, the social contract of that content since the ‘90s has been that it is fair use. Anyone can copy it, recreate with it, reproduce with it. That has been “freeware,” if you like, that’s been the understanding.

Yeah, that's how I've always thought of it.

VirtualOdour ,

He's right, information wants to be free. Don't support stronger copyright just to spite people it'll benefit

elias_griffin ,
@elias_griffin@lemmy.world avatar

In fact just the other day information wanted a ham sandwhich before I set it free so it could find more people not on an empty stomach :/

Draedron ,

Its not stolen if it is still there afterwards.

elias_griffin ,
@elias_griffin@lemmy.world avatar

Oh yeah, tell me about Intellectual Property, Patent, Invention, and Ideation thievery, was it still there afterwards? IP theft has been recognized for centuries.

Back to the basement Mustafa Jr..

bitchkat ,

Yes but you don't have a right to create derivative works which by definition is all that AI can spit out.

afraid_of_zombies ,

I am so glad humans are never derivative with culture. Just look at the movie The Fast and Furious. If we were making derivative works we would live in some crazy world where that would be a franchise with ten movies, six video games, a fashion line, board games, toys, theme park attractions, and an animated series that ran for six seasons.

bitchkat ,

All of those derivative works are licensed.

afraid_of_zombies ,

Not my point.

Sorgan71 , (edited )

You cant steal data. violating copyright (Which ai training does not do) is not theft.

Knock_Knock_Lemmy_In ,
DrElementary ,

violating copywright (Which ai training does not do)
I would say that's still very much up for debate, legally and morally

Sorgan71 ,

There is no moral issue.

Leate_Wonceslace ,
@Leate_Wonceslace@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

At the risk of being pedantic, I should point out that morality doesn't come into the question. Copyright is a matter of law, and nothing else. Personally, I don't consider it a legitimate institution; the immorality is how companies wield it like a cudgel to entrench their control over culture.

balder1991 ,

copyright is a matter of law, and nothing else

This assertion dismisses the ethical considerations often intertwined with legal principles. Laws (including copyright laws) are influenced by moral and ethical values, and there are often huge books on theories about the validity of certain things which serve as the starting point of collections of laws.

the immorality is how companies wield it like a cudgel to entrench their control over culture

While some companies do exploit copyright laws, not all companies use it in this way and whether it brings more harm than good is a point of discussion. But it can’t be generalized.

This completely overlooks the positive aspects of copyright as well, such as protecting the rights of individual creators and ensuring they can earn something from their own work.

Leate_Wonceslace ,
@Leate_Wonceslace@lemmy.dbzer0.com avatar

Whether or not copyright law has been violated is not a question of morality.

This assertion dismisses the ethical considerations often intertwined with legal principles.

No, that's stupid. Copyright is a purely legal framework. That's it, end of story. If you still don't understand, reread the entire discussion.

sugar_in_your_tea ,

Exactly. Violation of copyright may be an ethical or unethical act, but that doesn't change the fact that copyright law was violated.

afraid_of_zombies ,

Anyone in this thread is creating derivative works and you should not be reading it without the written permission of verge.com's parent company.

elias_griffin ,
@elias_griffin@lemmy.world avatar

So Mustafa steals from the entire world and justifies it by pointing to an abstraction that cannot be proven. It's already complete as they can admit it now and throw Billions at corrupt judges over a decade which will be too late.

These tech-god pyschopaths hate us.

masterspace ,

Man this is fucking asinine. No one hates you. Certainly not the actual researchers and engineers building these products.

Capitalism fucks over everyone who's not immediately useful. AI is just modelling algorithms after neurons and discovering that that lets us solve a whole new class of fuzzy pattern matching problems.

The two of them together promises to fuck us over even more because that was one of the main things that we used to be better than computers at, but the solution is not remove the new technology from the equation, it's to remove the old and broken system of resource allocation that has and continues to fuck us no matter what.

elias_griffin ,
@elias_griffin@lemmy.world avatar

Look at this AI paid influencer everybody! Who pays you Mustafa Jr? Most everyone knows that AI is gigging them now. When you steal from the world, that is definite hate but It was meant in the aggregate, stupified sanctimonious simpleton.

P.S. Take your "Capitalism Sucks" Marxist bullshit back to Russia, Vatnik and take Mustafa with you.

masterspace ,

Lmao, the dumb capitalist corpo thinks Marxists are motivated by payment.

Learn how to think before you type.

autotldr Bot ,

This is the best summary I could come up with:


Microsoft AI boss Mustafa Suleyman incorrectly believes that the moment you publish anything on the open web, it becomes “freeware” that anyone can freely copy and use.

When CNBC’s Andrew Ross Sorkin asked him whether “AI companies have effectively stolen the world’s IP,” he said:

That certainly hasn’t kept many AI companies from claiming that training on copyrighted content is “fair use,” but most haven’t been as brazen as Suleyman when talking about it.

Speaking of brazen, he’s got a choice quote about the purpose of humanity shortly after his “fair use” remark:

Suleyman does seem to think there’s something to the robots.txt idea — that specifying which bots can’t scrape a particular website within a text file might keep people from taking its content.

Disclosure: Vox Media, The Verge’s parent company, has a technology and content deal with OpenAI.


The original article contains 351 words, the summary contains 139 words. Saved 60%. I'm a bot and I'm open source!

A_Very_Big_Fan ,

Look, guys! The TLDR bot is stealing!

afraid_of_zombies ,

Yeps. The same way when my coworkers talk about sports ball without the expressed permission of multiple corporations.

A_Very_Big_Fan ,

Impressive that your coworkers discuss the events exclusively by recalling 60% of the announcer's words and then quoting them verbatim.

afraid_of_zombies ,

I am almost afraid to go down this rabbit hole but I have no idea what you are talking about.

A_Very_Big_Fan ,

I got the math the wrong way around but read the bottom of the bot's post. The bot's job is to cut the fluff out of articles, and it copy/pastes the remaining text for us to read here.

So my comment should have said 40%, but the point was if we're comparing what the bot did with your coworkers talking about a game, it'd be more akin to them reciting the commentator verbatim.

afraid_of_zombies ,

I thought that even discussing the game without the express permission of the media company you used to watch and the sports league was a violation. Not sure why you are bringing commentary on commentary in it. Again not a sports ball guy but when I do hear people talk about sports they are talking about sports not the person talkimg about sports.

A_Very_Big_Fan ,

In what country are you not allowed to talk about something you watched

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